Film and Family

Ep. 68 - Movie Club: Delicious

February 23, 2022 Anna Thalman
Film and Family
Ep. 68 - Movie Club: Delicious
Show Notes Transcript

We've started a movie club! Every month, we'll release a podcast with ideas and questions you can use to discuss a new (or old) movie with your family or friends. February's pick is a French flick that imagines the origins of the world's first restaurant.

is a treat that lives up to its name. We realized as we recorded this podcast how much more we appreciate the film after taking time to discuss it together. We would love to have you join the conversation and share your own insights and takeaways. Email us at

Isn’t it interesting how the word appreciate is used in economic terms to describe a rise in value?Things appreciate in value when we invest time or money into them. Taking time to appreciate or discuss a film after you watch it, increases its value to you as a viewer. 

Our new movie club series gives you an opportunity to practice this pattern, add some variety to your media diet, and lead a monthly discussion with your own group of movie-loving friends or family members.

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Hi. Welcome to the podcast. Today we're going to be talking about a movie. Yes. We're kicking off a new series where we want to talk about movies. I mean, we always talk about making movies, but we'd like to talk about specific movies that we're watching. We get a lot of people asking. What do you guys recommend? What are you watching? How do you pick which films you watch and how do you have a discussion afterwards? And so we just thought we would pick one of the films. We watch every once in a while and do a podcast on it. And we're not going to be talking about our review of it. It's not like a, is this good? Or is this bad or how much we liked it so much as trying to be media literate. What can we learn from the theme of the film? What can we learn from the craft of how they created the film? Maybe we can give you a little bit of behind the scenes occasionally, or some context for it. And we kind of thought it would be fun if you wanted to create sort of a book club. But movie club, movie group, I keep wanting to call it movie group. We haven't decided what to call this series yet, but maybe it'll be movie group. But you could go along with these episodes and say, okay, this month with our movie group and get a group of people together, we're going to watch this film. We'll listen to the podcast episode about it and have a discussion and you can steal the questions we use in the podcast. And use them for your group. And get some interesting discussions going, or it could just be your family, you know, however you want to use it. Hopefully, this gives you a jumping off point. Yeah. And so what we'll usually do as well as hopefully now, and again, we'll be able to tell you, Hey, coming up is a episode on such and such a film. So next we're going to do a troll in central park and you can just go watch it. And we're going to do an episode on a troll in central park. You just pick that. Just kidding. Um, And, uh, But this episode is actually about a French film, which we'll talk a little bit, I think about how we found the film and why we decided to watch it, which isn't really frankly, super complicated or breathtaking, in my opinion, I think we're just. I've found it on rotten tomatoes. I didn't know the film existed and it showed up and it had a 100% on rotten tomatoes and I thought, okay. It seems interesting. And Anna and I watched the trailer and we thought that looks really good. So we watched it. And I know that's not like the most. Profound way to choose your films. I definitely don't think rotten tomatoes is always right, but I think the convincing factor was not just that it had. It seems to be noteworthy and of good report. But I think that the real thing was that the trailer looked like something that we would be interested in and they compared it to Babette's feast, which is a movie that we really liked. And so, we won't. You know, I won't say if it was Babette's feast or was of that caliber. But it definitely had beautiful cinematography of food, which we might get into a little later in this episode. But first I think we want to give a quick update. On the loved and lost. Yeah. So the loved and loss is our feature film. Right now. We're in, post-production still. And we are locking the edit or getting close. I think we've said that for a few weeks now, but it is a process of thinking it's maybe ready to be locked and then we test screen it and we get a bunch of feedback. And then we realized that we're not as close as we thought, and we go back and. Re edit everything and test it again. And so on. In the real world, there are deadlines for these sorts of things, which we don't live in the real world. We live in our basement, but, we have a basement. It's. That's where we. That's where I'm living and breathing. And the, um, we make, we shoot them upstairs and we added them downstairs. In this case But a lot of life has been happening since then. We have selected our composer. And other members of the team in post or getting more locked in. So it's really exciting and, and, the trailer is very close to being locked, the unofficial trailer on official trailer, but we will be sharing it most likely with, those of you who are on the email list. So if you want to be more up to date on. Future podcast episodes and our movie trailer. And it's like the first sort of outside world glimpse that everyone's going to see at this movie we've been talking about forever. Is it any good? Are these guys, you know, for real. You can watch the trailer. And just judges, thereby, but we like the trailer. Movie's okay. But the trailer is good. I'm actually, you know, when we made the movie, we were always saying, well, at least it will have a really good trailer and have a good trailer. Now I'm actually starting to feel like the trailer is okay. I think the movies better. I don't know. I just think. The trailer. Has to work narratively as well as, you know, have some of the nice shots. And I was thinking of, it's going to be a great trailer by just thinking of all the amazing shots we had and, you know, some moments that are working really well. In the film. And yet we kind of realized we had to take some of those out of the trailer. Otherwise it ruins the viewing experience. Like it gave away certain plot points. If we included stuff in the trailer, Before someone watched it. So you can't put everything in the trailer, um, where you can, but it might just take away from the film. But enough about ours. Let's get into this movie that we watched delicious. Delicious. Which I'm a big fan of things that are delicious. So this was a foodie. So that was a shoe in not hard to convince me to want to watch it at. Basically just like gratuitous. You know, food imagery that, and I just couldn't resist. really delicious was is of 2021 films just came out in September. So the latter end of this last year, unless you're listening to this in the future, the latter end of the year 2021. And, it was directed and co-written by Eric. Bernard all the names. And all the, you know, a lot of the things. In this movie or in French. We don't because it's French. It's. It was written in French and it was made by French people and it was acted by French actors with French names. And we can't say any of them. It's really a shame. So we're gonna, we're gonna work on that. We're going to work on our French, but for today, you're just going to have to. You're gonna have to listen to it. And it was co-written by Nicholas will. Boot grief. So I really think that the best place we want to live. In terms of discussion about this film is the story and the script. And so I really wanted to mention who directed it and the two. People who wrote it. and this is definitely not a first feature. Eric has made, it would appear several films that I have not seen. So I might be going and watching some more of his films. yeah. Based on my viewing experience on delicious. And, there's a whole big cast of characters, but mainly it centers around, a man going by. Ma. Man it's like, it looks like man, Sarone. You're a drinker like me and, the woman who's sort of the. Next lead characters, Lewis. Yeah. So this is sort of, it's historical fiction, but, kind of loosely based on an origin story of the first restaurant in France. Which actually was in Paris and it was around the same time period, but they're kind of staging this as right before the French revolution. Kind of imagining what that first restaurant might've looked like if it was out in the country. And with the sentiments that people were having towards, French aristocracy. Sort of brewing and people feeling like. Down with privilege is the thing they say in the movie. That they're tired of the French being gluttonous and wasteful with the. All this being, what did I say? The French I. I mean, they're all French aristocracy. Having these gluttonous meals, just as a matter of show. And then there's all these poor that are starving and living off of rash. And so that's kind of the context of this. Story. And I think it's also a nice film about entrepreneurship, because there's sort of this main character, who's the chef for a duke who works for him in his fancy kitchen, but he. Doesn't have the creative freedom that he wants. And eventually he makes this little pastry and he's kind of ridiculed fit and they don't want to eat potatoes because it's dirty or whatever. Yeah, it grows from the ground. It's like a low peasant food. And so all they wanted him to do is apologize and he refused to apologize. He said, there's nothing to apologize for. And so he kind of established this character that he's a little bit proud. Of his work and, and stubborn but then he gets fired and he has to go out and live. At this little outpost in the country with his son. Been coming Benjamin. I'm probably saying it wrong, but yeah, we say we're going to, we're going to pronounce everything either. Like it's an English or Spanish because those are the only two languages we know. And so if it comes out sounding English or Spanish, almost. Undoubtedly, it's going to come out, not sounding like French. So. We forgot to mention that we were likely going to spoil this film in this episode. So if you don't want it to be spoiled, you can watch it before. And you'll, if you don't. You know, want to watch it, then you can just enjoy. Us telling you the story as we go through it. And cause I mean, I, it's hard for me to. Break down the meaning of the story without telling you yeah, like the end is where a lot of the meaning-making happens. I feel like. So, so yeah, it's really interesting. His managers kind of exiled her fired and, and goes back and kind of starts farming, but he is making simple food and has lost his zeal for cooking until this woman, Luis. Shows up. Several weeks later and. It's common custom that people. Well, anyway, before we get to that Lewis shows up and she basically. Insists that he take her in as his apprentice. to become a chef and he says that she's a woman and that's not appropriate. And that she is too old. And that it's too late for her to learn that he doesn't want to cook anymore and that he doesn't want to cook any more. He's kind of over it after getting fired and disgraced and, he's kind of, you know, Stubborn in that way, but it turns out Louis is equally stubborn and she just basically sits outside his house for like a couple of days and won't move. And offers him like her life savings in money. And just basically. I won't leave unless he takes her in as a. Isn't it protege. Yeah. So she, he does take her money and, and so she holds him to that commitment and kind of follows him around and like demands that he teach her what, what he's doing. And he starts to get into cooking again. It's interesting that his son. Benjamin, I think kind of sees this as an opportunity. He's seeing it as this, rejection and failure on his part, but his son sees the opportunity to have the creative freedom that he's always wanted. And so it's sort of that younger generation pushing for like, Let the working class create their own thing, make their own money and not have to be slaves to these higher up. Aristocracy. And, and have to do everything their way. According to their tastes and their desires. So it's kind of his. His, I think the main characters, chef guy's mindset, changing over the course of the film, to see things that way. And Benjamin is really the voice for the French revolution in this movie. And. And not just the French revolution, something that's that I want to point out is, One of our professors that we've mentioned several times on this podcast named Dean Duncan said that movies are never made about the time period in which they take place. They're always about the time period in which they're made. And so, the film delicious is most likely not really about the year 1789. It's about the year 2021, right. And so all of the. Social and political and human commentary is usually, or even political is going to be. It's really going to be about today that these people are, are living in today and they're interested in today. And when they look at the past, they see. They see shadows of values that they see kind of grew. People grappling with or themselves grappling with in today's modern age. And so to me, this film, and we'll get to this as we go on, I think is as much about. Filmmaking as it is about cooking and the aristocracy of France seems to be this. And maybe they didn't mean this, but I kind of saw it as this. This a representation of, the powers that be, or the movie studios that basically dictate this is, I mean, and this is in the movie. They have to basically say, this is exactly what is on the menu and you must make the menu. And, and it was almost always things that he didn't feel personally connected to. He, he wanted to make homegrown. Aromatics is what he says. He wanted to use homegrown aromatics as opposed to exotic spices and things like they were all in. Which I think is interesting. Cinnamon was an exotic spice in those days. I mean, that makes sense. But like now I think all of us consider cinnamon. Like that's the cheap spice that you can buy, like giant buckets, you know? And so he, he really wanted to make a certain kind of thing and he was ridiculed for using like potatoes. And so his son is like, you have total freedom now, but he's also like, but we're broken. You know, we have nothing. And yet. He finds his ingredients from the earth, which I also think is kind of this. Declaration of independent filmmaking, so to speak. It's like this. You know, like it's this thing we've talked about, which is like resource filmmaking. This is me projecting myself onto the film. But that's really how we understand things. Right. We see the lens. We only have our own two eyes, right? Those are our lenses and, and the brain behind those two eyes is the, how we process these things. So when I see this film, I really do see that as like resource filmmaking. After being rejected by Hollywood and you're kind of having to. Figure it out. And, it's a bell carets character of Louise is basically a intern. Big movie dreams. I don't know. Yeah. And he takes her out to this big field when he finally decides to teach her. And says, find something edible, like go find stuff. We'll find this food. And wake me up when you found food. So he lays down asleep and she goes and just harvest from whatever she can find on this mountain side. And then they go home and they talk about, okay, You can't use this. These mushrooms are poisonous, but here you go. Like these are edible, this is good. And he's teaching her how to use the resources she has to create delicious food. And so. He kind of gets this opportunity to cook for the duke again, cause the duke is coming to visit and they. You know, do this elaborate meal exactly to the menu. And then. There's all these tragedies. There's a huge fire. He's like reaching in with his hands to save everything and burns his hands. So the apprentice, Louis has to do a lot of the cooking for him and they lose all these ingredients. So he ends up using his own ingredients and kind of doing things his own way. The duke doesn't even show up in the end to this meal. As he says that. His mistress got hungry and they stopped early. And basically, well, since we had to stop early, we're not hungry anymore. So sorry. And this. Let's talk about other appetites being satisfied instead, and there's sort of this theme of appetites and like the appetite for sex or the appetite for food, or, you know, the, the way that the. Gluttonous are just consuming to satisfy their appetites and not really, Based on need or to, you know, be whole summer, be alive. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and so it's really interesting because once again, in my, in my personal. Framework of this film. It's. It's this world we live in, where, when we're trying to make movies through Hollywood. This is bad. I, I'm not trying to say that. I would never say yes to a Hollywood film, but I do know that it's a very common tale that someone comes along and it doesn't even have to be in Hollywood. It's just working with fallible human beings. We come along and say, Hey, I've got this project, I've got this money. I need someone to make it. This is a big break. And then you get all excited about it. And then you put in tons of work. This is your big chance, or maybe it's your second chance. And, and then like out of the blue, they'll just be like, oh, sorry. We. I know we told you that this was all a done deal. This was all definitely happening. But actually we, we, we went with someone else we ended up doing so. Yeah, we just, we, we went another direction with it. Or whatever, or we just scrapped the whole thing and, and, we hope you can. You know, after putting in all that time and sweat equity and all this other stuff. We hope that you can find some work to pay for the sacrifices you've just made on our behalf and we're not going to help you at all. And so that's basically what happens is they're basic. They just say. Well, we went with someone else. We got some food somewhere. We stopped and. And they're just kind of infuriated, but at that point in the film, There's a big twist with Lewis's character. Where, we revealed that she was going to actually poison his former boss and then it's revealed that she was actually a Marcie's Marquis. She was a member of the Royal. That class. Yeah. Yeah. We are so. Like at a loss for the correct French terms. But, anyway, her, this man that. Months around the chef used to work for. Was. Guilty of like murdering her husband because of like offenses that they'd had against each other. Trying to force her into relationship with him. And yeah, he was just, she was trying to poison him. That was kind of her intention. All along of learning to apprentice for this cook was she assumed that his, the, the duke would come back around eventually and want to hire him again. Cause he was like the best chef ever. And she would get to exact her revenge. And of course, since the duke doesn't show him. They. They almost eat the food and she has to know. We'll hide it and they throw the food out and the chickens eat and they die immediately. And so she's kind of found guilty of her, her agenda. And so the stakes regarding aristocracy and this family situation start to get higher. And then, you know, the chef starts to fall in love with the apprentice. But, But then they, they start to kind of try and move on with life at that point. And that's when they decided we're going to create a restaurant for the common people. For anyone who wants to pass by or anyone locally who lives here. To actually have like a dining experience. And so it kind of shows this like, you know, origin story of a superhero, but it's like origin story of the restaurant where it's like, we could have tables and we can have menus and we can have waiters and they kind of come up with everything like, and it's like, oh, Brilliant, you know, And it's actually kind of fun. They do a good job of that, I think. But, and they actually start to have some success in, it becomes the story of entrepreneurship. To a degree where they start to, come to an understanding that they could actually create a new life of fine cuisine, but they're making fine cuisine for common people instead of for. Aristocracy, which is, which was considered like, Totally wrong. Yeah, it was, it had never been done before, but, it was something where anyone could come and sit down and the people would eat together and. So there is this element. I think of forgiveness as well, where she. Louis is able to. Serve the duke. They do end up having him at the restaurant eventually, and she decides not to poison him. Even though. She could have, and she felt like he deserved it. but it's also still a revenge plot in a lot of ways. It's sort of a, like, I don't need you anymore. And look what we've done. Not scared of you anymore. She says I'm not scared of you. And you can kind of see how. He's appalled by what they're doing. And, and they're kind of triumphant and they're like thing that no one thought they could do, they were able to do and successfully, and. his disdain for it is, becomes very public and kind of embarrassing. So, yeah. It's, it's nice. Now you can probably tell that we liked a lot of the themes in this movie, by the way, we're talking about them. Yeah. So, yeah, and, and honestly, like it was so beautifully shot as well. That even if it wasn't a super, emotionally engaging experience for me, I liked it. I liked enjoyed watching the film. I wasn't really like on the edge of my seat or anything about what was going to happen or feeling super strong emotions while I watched it. But. I thought that the cinematography was beautiful and they would do these little, like still life portraits of a table with, you know, all the textures and colors. And it looked very much like a painting. of kind of the pieces after they make food, you know, the dishes and the food that's left in the little scraps, but. Of course, there's always something moving. There's a butterfly or there's some light dancing or whatever in the frame. And those were just gorgeous to look at. It was one of the most carefully shot films I've ever seen. Actually, I. I thought it was pretty exquisite. I feel like they approached the cinematography the way these characters approached food and. It married itself? Well, I think the way they. They very carefully crafted this thing from a. From a very, Sort of passionate place. I think they were really excited. To tell the story and you can tell by the care and love that they put into the imagery. And I thought the acting was, also careful and, and you could tell it was well written and well rehearsed. It wasn't like an improvisational sort of like. I mean, our movie's very improvisation with a lot of like improv camera work and some of the lines are. Accurate description. Some of them aren't. This movie was very, you could tell they were very carefully executing things. The way that they carefully executed the creation of food. And I thought that that, That created a rhythm and a parallel. And I think that made sense. You know, it doesn't have to, it didn't have to be that way, but I thought it was a. It strengthened, I think what they were. Wanting to accomplish, because I think it seemed clear to me that this film was as concerned about. Portraying the art. The, you know, the culinary arts in an, in a way that was honorable and appreciative. As it was about. Telling a story about their own, the filmmakers ideas. they were really. Admiring the beauty of nature, the beauty of humans, I think they were really interested in the human face and the way they shot this film and really in the beauty of cooking and food. And. And things like that. And so there was, there was, there was a lot of admiration, I think, happening with the creation of this film and that I think gave it some beauty that. That almost stands apart from. The narrative, even though I still think that the script is the most important part. Of any film, Most films, especially if there is a script. But the end scripts exist either. On paper or in the editing room, even if it's a documentary eventually. What said has said, and what's done is done, but, but. But in this film, you know, there was something else going on there. And I think that that's part of what makes it an enjoyable process to watch because it's so enjoys the beauty of its subjects. That it's hard not to enjoy them yourself while you're watching it. You're just like, wow, this is beautiful. Wow. This is enjoyable. Like, this is a. A nice thing to go along with, which I think is from a filmmaking standpoint. Something I hadn't. Always thought about, but it's just this deep appreciation for something that you get to kind of experience with the filmmakers because of how. How hard they worked to appreciate it with the camera and with the editing and with the writing. So, yes, I would recommend that you not watch this when you're hungry. Well, you'll be hungry either way. When you finish watching. If you're anything like Anna. You have some, you know, French cuisine on hand, that would be helpful because. It is hard to watch and not feel like you can just almost smell. All the food that they're making or taste it. so it is very. Well, that brings me to the sound design, you know, we're limited to only two senses, right? Seitan sound. Hearing. with movies and the sound design in this film is as central as the cinematography. It. Like. The handling of cloth, the Hendrix flower in the hands, you know, I'm doing this next to the microphone. You know, there, you could just hear. Like the crunching and the slicing and the. And you don't. Most people, the lay person, I don't think we'd be like, well, they mixed this in an interesting way or whatever. But it has like a logical effect on your viewing experience, make no mistake. And so that's something I. As I was listening to it, they, they treated. The sound effects. In this film almost as carefully as they would treat like editing dialogue in an action movie where the dialogue is just crispy and sharpen right up front and your nose and everything's ADR. Do you know? It's it's. There's almost a voice to the knives and the spoons and the forks and the. And the charading and you know, all that stuff, it all has like a. Very central. Experiential quality to it. Yeah. Yeah. That's true. So I think that's, it's not worthy to, to, to point out the craft in the creation of it, but I think we could even get more into, I don't know. Do you have any other thoughts on like narrative or character? I think we covered most of it, but I would encourage you, you know, as you go and watch this film and other films to take the time to sit down and discuss. Afterwards, what is the theme of the film? What is the artist trying to say? Do you agree with that or not? And how did they do it? In what ways? Did they do it that you like, or that you would prefer they'd done it a different way, whatever, but, you know, Austin Kleon always talks about steal like an artist and that's his New York times bestselling book is called steal, like an artist, which I highly recommend. And he talks about just. Always looking for what you can steal, what you really love from other artists that you can use to fuel your own work. And definitely there's plenty in this film to admire. We found. Enjoyable and noteworthy and yeah, it's good to, I think watch. Oh, I think, I think what we just talked about the cinematography and the, And the sound design I think were inspiring because they were so painterly. The lighting was especially carefully done where the interior has always had like a warm. Like candle light or hearth light. And then the exteriors had this lovely, light from the sunset or. They get like a tealish Greenlight from like, Nighttime windows that I'd never seen used as like a rendering of nightlight. It was so interesting to me, it was like a Moonlight reflecting off the leaves, greenish nose that would come in and like, it was like the fill light against this. Bright orange fire inside at night. It was pretty stunning. Yeah. And I think that. I think that this movie appreciated the inherent. Enjoyment. That is available to our senses in natural things and the food that just grows. Outside and the. Beauty of nature and that's kind of nicely contrasted against this sort of artificial beauty of. The aristocracy with their powdered wigs and their powdered faces and their costumes that they wear. next to these natural fabrics and linens and these natural. This home that's made of natural materials and. I don't know. I like that emphasis on. What is naturally beautiful without any. Edifice or. a dormant on our part, like. And it's that way about the food and the human characters in the sense that it's like, Like there's these like almost man-made men. And there's these God made men and these people who are the common class and the. You know, the common feels so beautiful in this film. And the. The aristocrats don't, I mean, it's really easy with French aristocracy to always portray them in like this caricature kind of ridiculous light because they have the big pink. Blush on the man and like the super tall white powdered wigs. And, you know, eventually for us, it looks like a. Clown, but that's how they dressed. And it was their sign of. Of great wealth, but, but the film itself also kind of says, but we'll also look at these trees and look, look at the light and look at the. The plants that grow from the earth and the characters themselves appreciated that more, especially Mosul the chef. And so. Yeah. I think that, that, that approach, like you said, I would love to steal that approach to filmmaking in the sense that it's like, well, I think that's beautiful. I appreciate that. And I just want to. Appreciate this thing that frankly, I have nothing to do with, you know, it's not like the filmmakers can take credit for the beauty of the world or nature. Or the human face or the sound of someone. Rata and show it to you. Yeah, but. But they have to more than just pointing their camera at it and showing it to you that they have to show it to you in its best light or render it in the way that they see it and appreciate it. Because someone standing next to me might still be seeing something from a different point of view. And so their camera is their point of view. So I love that, that I do and have. Stealing that. Almost small, like stealing a perspective than stealing a particular. Craft technique, you know, but it's kind of a timeless beauty, right? The false, like. The clothing and the makeup or whatever. Style and fashion. Fades away, but the stuff that's. Beautiful in the 17 hundreds is still beautiful today. That's nature. I mean, this wasn't made in 17 hundreds obviously, but. But it's still kind of carries that message, that those things are timeless and their beauty. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. Well from a narrative standpoint, I think some of the things that I really liked about it, I really liked how they built character. There's this really wonderful point where. When she lies about her origin story before, as he finds out that she was royalty, she says that she was a whore. And, because he starts to detect the way she walks and he says the only people who walk like that are, are, whores or. Princesses. And if you were of the Royal class, You would be here, which turns out to be false. She was, but, so she goes along with the other. You know, sh he's onto her and he's on a 50, 50 chances. She says, yeah, I was a. I was a whore and she tells us false back story. And eventually. He, he tries to come onto her when he's teaching her and she rejects him. And she says I paid. So I decide, which I thought was an interesting line. And then later. Knowing his story in the prologue of the film where he refused to apologize. She stops. Kind of helping and serving and being his apprentice and learning. And she, but she's very angry with him. She gets fed up with him and other men who've made advances made advances essentially. And so she says, so you are all the same. So then the next day or subsequent days, time passes and. And he says, very frankly, he says, I I'm sorry. Forgive me. And it won't happen again. And she sort of reluctantly forgives him, but I think that's a really interesting way of building character. In, in the sense that we have this sort of backstory with her, and then we see her stand up for herself. And then we have this guy who we know. He is a proud. Really. You know, talented person, but. But not want to say, sorry, in that moment. He says, sorry for the things that he truly has need to apologize for. Right. He's not gonna apologize for using potatoes and giving them to the Royal, but he is going to say, sorry for doing something that was inappropriate. And he's sincere about it. So I just thought that that was a nice way of building. The bond that those two characters had together by showing this is something this character never does. And then they do it. I think that's a really cool way to build character where you. It's not just a way that you show. Who that person is, which is nice, but it was also a way that you show how that person grows. And so I know that, James Mangold talked about that as his character that he wrote, that was played by Christian bale and Ford versus Ferrari. He same thing where at the end, he's like, what's the thing his character would never do. And that's slow down and tie on purpose. I mean, this is a guy who will win at all costs, right? Sorry for spoiling Ford versus Ferrari, but it's showing this character growth by saying. This is the last thing his character would ever do. And then they do it. And often it's either because they've fallen completely from grace or they've achieved like a remarkable growth. And learning. And, so I, I don't know that was something I've noticed in this film and the way they told the story. And it's something I kind of wanted to. Keep in mind when I'm thinking about my characters, especially my protagonists, like what, what is what they would never, what is something they would never do? And why and what would cause them to do it. Eventually, I just, I it's just a very simple principle, but it was a good reminder. Yeah. I love that. What would you say in like a single statement was the theme in your mind, Ana for this film? Or a theme that jumped out to you. I think it. It would be something to do with integrity. Being true to. Yourself, true to the people around you. I'm honest in your interactions with those people, but also honest in the work that you do, that it's something that you believe in and the value. Did that provides for other people? Not for everyone, because in this case, the duke did not appreciate his. Experimentations in the kitchen, if you would make something that was not on the menu. He was chastised, but when he had that freedom and he was true to his own. Tastes and his own desires. There were people who came into would appreciate that. Who would otherwise be ignored? And I think that was a powerful theme for me. Hmm. Yeah, I like that a lot. Yes. I got a lot of that as well out of the film about like that thing you're saying about integrity and about like an artist who's really trying to share his view of the world through his food. Because that is his view of the world. It's like he, he perceives the world through tastes because he's a chef. And he's trying to help other people realize that. Things that come out of the earth taste. Good period. And you're not as a chef supposed to mask or change that experience. You're supposed to enhance it. And help them actually taste the potato actually tastes the spice or the, or the whatever, like they're, they're tasting these national ingredients. That's kind of his philosophy on cooking and there. You know, I think we've even taken all this water's masterclass will. Anna did. I didn't think I didn't take it at all. And that's very much her approach, but for me, something else that's somewhat related to that is just this. This value of, I mean. Maybe this sounds pretentious, but this value of creation. Both of the man. You know, mankind and also of, Nature, but it's really like this, this really democratic message about the value of all human beings and how. You can teach anyone. To cook. Not to sound like. Ratatouille. But you can also, You can, that everyone deserves the best. This idea that we can give the best cuisine to even the common man. And that's not something we reserve only for the richest or the most wonderful people. Or the most noble. And they might even appreciate it more because we'll know that was a big theme in the movie is appreciation and that only the novel could. Have the God-like sensibility to be able to perceive the nuances of fine cuisine and that giving it to common people was like throwing your pearls before swine. And they wouldn't even understand the value of it, but that's just not true. Th these people were in most of need of those pearls, right? They, they were the people who were starving to death. And, and so he was giving them an experience that they had never had before and they truly could see it in context of. The world and things as they really are. And so I just think that was, for me, it was. It read as a theme of. Just the worth of a soul. Yeah, that's always a common person, so yeah. And then they even do in the end. Hire some of the beggars, some of the thieves who still food from him. Yeah. Working as waiters and waitresses and. They're like children that would sell for 200. Yeah. And she says, are you encouraging theft? And he says, What is he saying? I can't remember it. That's an interesting part of the film where like, he, he sets bread out for them to steal. And, he basically says, they'll pay me back later. They'll give me flower. Like they're starving. Yeah. You know, what other choice do I have? Like, yeah, he said something else there, but she was confused by, I wish I could remember the exact line, but it's so I can't remember. So you have to go watch the movie ha. You know, I'm really glad we recorded this episode because it wasn't just, you know, we had a short discussion after we watched the film. We almost always do which some of us. You know, a lot of people don't even talk about the films that they are watching after they watched them. But, but doing this episode really caused us to have to. You know, curate the questions and summarize the story and do all the things that you do in an, almost like a test screening. And we even used some of those questions from our test screenings, that we give to audiences, but it, let me get more out of the film. It. You know, not to be punny, but it's kind of like chewing your food a little slower. And that actually lets you get more. You're not nutrients. It doesn't necessarily make you enjoy the taste more, even though that might happen. And so you might like the food more. Sometimes I think if I chew my food for too long, it starts to be a lesson. What experience cause it's just like you chew it until it's mush, but, but you do extract more of the value of that particular food. And so when we do that with our films, We we get more. And so I, I don't know. I'm just feeling that now having this discussion with you and I wish we could talk longer about it, but. It makes me appreciate the work that went into the film and into the writing of the script and into the creation and rendering of it. And so I'm really grateful. I feel like this odd gratitude towards these filmmakers who put this movie together, not to gash or anything. there's lots of movies out there and. When people work this hard and in this. Much unity to bring something and bring a vision to life like this. It doesn't always mean it's a good thing. I think there are some. Damaging messages out there. But even those I think are good to talk about. I just think it's really, really good to talk about what we're watching, because like you said, we get more out of it. We can internalize the lessons or. At least maybe externalize the lessons by saying them. And then it helps us internalize them by remembering them. Yeah, just learning more. Yeah. Yeah. So I agree. I think the more you reap, the more you sell. So just taking some time to. Discuss after movie really adds a lot to the experience. So thanks for joining us and for being on the other side of this conversation, and please feel free, feel free to be a part of it. Especially if, if you end up. We're going to, we're going to actually announce further future movies that you can suggest films that you'd like us to watch. you can, if you watch the film in advance, you can submit questions or even your own thoughts. And we would love to be able to read those before we go into the next film. So stay tuned on future episodes. We will be announcing. Either in emails or in future episodes. Hey look out. We're going to work. You know, we just watched this film. We're going to do an episode on it next week or whatever, and you guys can participate in our movie group. Yeah, we'd love to engage with you. So don't ever hesitate to reach out. All right we'll see you later Right right